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OH:Concealed Carry Fail; Rapist Disarms Realtor
Gun Watch ^ | 16 December, 2014 | Dean Weingarten

Posted on 12/17/2014 1:16:05 AM PST by marktwain


No discussion of the advantages and disadvantages of open and concealed carry used to be complete without the obligatory theory that open carry was more dangerous.  It was asserted that a criminal will target the open carrier because they are armed.   Here is an example from freerepublic:

Why would anyone want the bad guy to shoot him first?
Fortunately, the gun culture is becoming educated in the matter.   People now realize that open carry promotes tactical deterrence.  There have been two known instances where open carriers have been targeted, but they are very rare.  The other side of the coin also occurs.  Concealed carriers are targeted because their attacker does *not* know they are armed, and the attacker sometimes wins.   In this case in Ohio, it is doubtful that the woman would have been attacked if the attacker knew that she was armed.

As is most common in rape cases, the assailant did not use a weapon other than his own body.  It, and the element of surprise, were enough to overcome the victim's defenses.  From the marionstar.com:
As she was struggling face down on the floor, the victim reached for her 9 mm Smith and Wesson handgun. Her attacker knocked the weapon out of her hand, causing the weapon to discharge. Each time she'd try to turn and fight back, her head was smashed against the floor.
The attacker probably did not know that she had a gun.  He came very close to being shot and/or killed.  A half second of inattention on his part, or a half second faster response by the victim, and he would have been.   A shot over the back of the neck and above your own buttocks is hard to miss, if you practice just a little bit.

It seems that the attacker was unnerved enough by his close call not to abscond with the victim's gun, which was worth considerably more than the money in her purse, that he did take.   Or, possibly, she managed to reach the gun and he fled, but she does not remember:
 "I don't remember how I got there, but I remember crouching in the corner with my back against the wall and my gun in my hand," she said. "The door was open. I didn't know if he was coming back."
In both circumstances, either an open or concealed carrier being targeted, the best solution is situational awareness.  The woman who was attacked acknowledges this:
"I'm a survivor," she said. "I haven't been back to work yet, but I will be. ... I thought I was invincible. I'm not. But the best tool's not a gun; it's the knowledge of your surroundings."
Everyone who studies self defense says the same thing.  An awareness of your surroundings is more important than having a weapon.   Most attacks can be avoided if you see them coming.  Open carry allows the attacker to avoid the open carrier; concealed carry gives the defender more of an element of surprise.

Open and concealed carry each have their advantages and disadvantages.  The best situation is to be able to use either or both methods when you find them appropriate.


 ©2014 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice is included.
Link to Gun Watch


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; Politics; Society
KEYWORDS: banglist; ccw; oh; opencarry
Open carry and concealed carry both have distinct advantages and disadvantages. Both should be available to all law abiding citizens.
1 posted on 12/17/2014 1:16:05 AM PST by marktwain
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To: marktwain

I don’t actually see a situation as a concealed carry fail. On the other hand I don’t think there must be legal difference between open and concealed carry at all. As far as you have right to bear arms does it really matter is it concealed or exposed?


2 posted on 12/17/2014 1:26:02 AM PST by wetphoenix
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To: wetphoenix; marktwain; Drumbo

No matter that CCW is legal in my state, most employers, including mine, forbid weapons on their property - even in one’s own car which spends the duration of the shift parked on their grounds.

So here’s the case where if I ultimately value my survival over employment, but must of course work for a living, my method of carry places more value on deep concealment rather than quick deployment. What my employer doesn’t know does not hurt me. But it might make the split second difference if I am forced to draw my weapon. Hopefully I’ll never face that, but I’m fine with going home unemployed to a grateful family.

However as the woman in this article points out, arming oneself while neglecting situational awareness may also make the difference.

I wish her a speedy recovery. She reads as a tough lady who will be fine, eventually.


3 posted on 12/17/2014 2:45:10 AM PST by Titan Magroyne (What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.)
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To: Titan Magroyne

“Surprise surprise!”,,Gomer Pyle would say about concealed carry.


4 posted on 12/17/2014 3:24:47 AM PST by Recompennation
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To: marktwain

If both types of carry are allowed, then the perps will be cats in a room full of rocking chairs... And isn’t that what we all want anyway?


5 posted on 12/17/2014 3:32:44 AM PST by Dixie Yooper (Ephesians 6:11)
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To: marktwain

‘But the best tool’s not a gun; it’s the knowledge of your surroundings.”’

Most important part of the article likely missed b/c readers fixate on the tool. Id amend that to read more like this but the woman is certainly on the right track....

But the best tool’s not a gun; it’s whats between your ears.

There’s NO substitute for training and education. Leave those out and you’re tossing the dice.


6 posted on 12/17/2014 4:02:48 AM PST by 556x45
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To: marktwain

This simply demonstrates that a person can be ambushed.

There isn’t a cop in this country that couldn’t be knocked out from behind while in uniform and armed.

Guns aren’t magical. I don’t think open carry would have mattered a wit in this case.


7 posted on 12/17/2014 4:26:11 AM PST by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: 556x45

Sadly, you’ve now got to view all lnteractios with strangers as high risk situations.


8 posted on 12/17/2014 4:35:11 AM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not A Matter of Opinion)
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To: SampleMan

I think the rapist would never have attacked her if she was openly armed. Most rapists say they do not attack armed women.

Most robbers do not attack armed cops either.

Predator learn to go after easy prey. If they go after dangerous prey, they may win a few times, but the odds are against them.


9 posted on 12/17/2014 5:01:18 AM PST by marktwain (The old media must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: marktwain

predator should be predators sticky keyboard..


10 posted on 12/17/2014 5:02:19 AM PST by marktwain (The old media must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: marktwain
Open carry and concealed carry both have distinct advantages and disadvantages. Both should be available to all law abiding citizens.

/thread

11 posted on 12/17/2014 6:04:22 AM PST by barefoot_hiker
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To: marktwain
I think the rapist would never have attacked her if she was openly armed. Most rapists say they do not attack armed women.

Possibly. But then again, rapists like the sense of power, so it might have just egged him on. Its hard to predict those things. Realtors are in a different situation than a woman walking to her car or answering her door. The rapist can wait to attack if an easy opportunity presents. If policewomen started patrolling alone on foot in bad neighborhoods, I think a disturbing number of them would end up getting raped/killed. There is a certain evil mindset to seeing an openly defiant (armed) woman, as a trophy challenge.

In the case of vulnerable female realtors, it would probably provide the best deterrence to scan the client's drivers license to the home office before going anywhere alone with them. Don't know if this was a client, or someone that came in the house behind her.

Knives are also undersold as defensive weapons. They are generally easier to conceal than a gun and can provide a good one time break-free defense. Most concealable knives are not large enough to kill quickly with one jab.

Another point here is that most rapists are "unarmed", which is a bit of knowledge to kick back Leftists when they start talking about the poor unarmed perp.

12 posted on 12/17/2014 6:06:05 AM PST by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: marktwain

By one account, at least part of the Chinese martial arts system known as Wing Chun was developed by Buddhist nuns.

Generally being smaller and weaker than men, they needed some means of defense at very close range, especially from a “bear hug” attack. So they developed the “iron hand” techniques.

With slow and methodical, ritual training, they were able to use individual fingers and even their hand, much like knives, at very close range. Nothing quite dissuades a rapist like having a finger shoved between his ribs into a lung, or a straightened hand shoved into his intestines.

This is not apocryphal, as some experts still follow the same ritual to learn the techniques today. About the only drawback is that they are very short range weapons only, and do not work at arms length, so other techniques must be used.

I mention this to once again suggest having a knife as a complementary tool to a gun. Losing your gun in a close quarters fight is bad, but if you have a knife backup available, at least you are not helpless.

And like the iron hand techniques, a very close range attack is still vulnerable to a very close range defense that a knife can provide.


13 posted on 12/17/2014 6:29:05 AM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy ("Don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative." -Obama, 09-24-11)
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