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DNA shows Irish people have more complex origins than previously thought
scott.net ^ | July 5, 2013 | Marie McKeown

Posted on 01/11/2014 6:13:55 AM PST by NYer

The blood in Irish veins is Celtic, right? Well, not exactly. Although the history many Irish people were taught at school is the history of the Irish as a Celtic race, the truth is much more complicated, and much more interesting than that ...

Research done into the DNA of Irish males has shown that the old Anthropological attempts to define 'Irish' have been misguided. As late as the 1950s researchers were busy collecting data among Irish people such as hair colour and height, in order to categorise them as a 'race' and define them as different to the British. In fact British and Irish people are closely related in their ancestry.

Research into Irish DNA and ancestry has revealed close links with Scotland stretching back to before the Ulster Planation of the early 1600s. But the closest relatives to the Irish in DNA terms are actually from somewhere else entirely!


Medieval map of Ireland, showing Irish tribes. Irish origin myths confirmed by modern scientific evidence



The earliest settlers came to Ireland around 10,000 years ago, in Stone Age times. There are still remnants of their presence scatter across the island. Mountsandel in Coleraine in the North of Ireland is the oldest known site of settlement in Ireland - remains of woven huts, stone tools and food such as berries and hazelnuts were discovered at the site in 1972.

But where did the early Irish come from? For a long time the myth of Irish history has been that the Irish are Celts. Many people still refer to Irish, Scottish and Welsh as Celtic culture - and the assumtion has been that they were Celts who migrated from central Europe around 500BCE. Keltoi was the name given by the Ancient Greeks to a 'barbaric' (in their eyes) people who lived to the north of them in central Europe. While early Irish art shows some similarities of style to central European art of the Keltoi, historians have also recognised many significant differences between the two cultures.

The latest research into Irish DNA has confirmed that the early inhabitants of Ireland were not directly descended from the Keltoi of central Europe. In fact the closest genetic relatives of the Irish in Europe are to be found in the north of Spain in the region known as the Basque Country. These same ancestors are shared to an extent with the people of Britain - especially the Scottish.

DNA testing through the male Y chromosome has shown that Irish males have the highest incidence of the haplogroup 1 gene in Europe. While other parts of Europe have integrated contiuous waves of new settlers from Asia, Ireland's remote geographical position has meant that the Irish gene-pool has been less susceptible to change. The same genes have been passed down from parents to children for thousands of years.

This is mirrored in genetic studies which have compared DNA analysis with Irish surnames. Many surnames in Irish are Gaelic surnames, suggesting that the holder of the surname is a descendant of people who lived in Ireland long before the English conquests of the Middle Ages. Men with Gaelic surnames, showed the highest incidences of Haplogroup 1 (or Rb1) gene. This means that those Irish whose ancestors pre-date English conquest of the island are direct descendants of early stone age settlers who migrated from Spain.


The Kingdom of Dalriada c 500 AD is marked in green. Pictish areas marked yellow. Irish and British DNA : a comparison

Irish origin myths confirmed by modern scientific evidence

One of the oldest texts composed in Ireland is the Leabhar Gabhla, the Book of Invasions. It tells a semi-mythical history of the waves of people who settled in Ireland in earliest time. It says the first settlers to arrive in Ireland were a small dark race called the Fir Bolg, followed by a magical super-race called the Tuatha de Danaan (the people of the goddess Dana).

Most interestingly, the book says that the group which then came to Ireland and fully established itself as rulers of the island were the Milesians - the sons of Mil, the soldier from Spain. Modern DNA research has actually confirmed that the Irish are close genetic relatives of the people of northern Spain.

While it might seem strange that Ireland was populated from Spain rather than Britain or France, it is worth remembering that in ancient times the sea was one of the fastest and easiest ways to travel. When the land was covered in thick forest, coastal settlements were common and people travelled around the seaboard of Europe quite freely.

I live in Northern Ireland and in this small country the differences between the Irish and the British can still seem very important. Blood has been spilt over the question of national identity.

However, the lastest research into both British and Irish DNA suggests that people on the two islands have much genetically in common. Males in both islands have a strong predominance of Haplogroup 1 gene, meaning that most of us in the British Isles are descended from the same Spanish stone age settlers.

The main difference is the degree to which later migrations of people to the islands affected the population's DNA. Parts of Ireland (most notably the western seaboard) have been almost untouched by outside genetic influence since hunter-gatherer times. Men there with traditional Irish surnames have the highest incidence of the Haplogroup 1 gene - over 99%.

At the same time London, for example, has been a mutli-ethnic city for hundreds of years. Furthermore, England has seen more arrivals of new people from Europe - Anglo-Saxons and Normans - than Ireland. Therefore while the earliest English ancestors were very similar in DNA and culture to the tribes of Ireland, later arrivals to England have created more diversity between the two groups.

Irish and Scottish people share very similar DNA. The obvious similarities of culture, pale skin, tendancy to red hair have historically been prescribed to the two people's sharing a common celtic ancestry. Actually it now seems much more likely that the similarity results from the movement of people from the north of Ireland into Scotland in the centuries 400 - 800 AD. At this time the kingdom of Dalriada, based near Ballymoney in County Antrim extended far into Scotland. The Irish invaders brought Gaelic language and culture, and they also brought their genes.

Irish Characteristics and DNA

The MC1R gene has been identified by researchers as the gene responsible for red hair as well as the accompanying fair skin and tendency towards freckles. According to recent research, genes for red hair first appeared in human beings about 40,000 to 50,000 years ago.

These genes were then brought to the British Isles by the original settlers, men and women who would have been relatively tall, with little body fat, athletic, fair-skinned and who would have had red hair. So red-heads may well be descended from the earliest ancestors of the Irish and British.

A spoof (and very funny) exploration into the characteristics of all Irish-blooded males can be read at this link: www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/weekend. Identified genes include IMG or the Irish Mother Gene and the GK (MF) S Gene Kelly-Michael-Flately-Syndrome which explains the inability of the Irish man to move his hips while dancing!



TOPICS: History; Science; Society
KEYWORDS: agriculture; ancientautopsies; ancientnavigation; bookofinvasions; bronzeage; caledonia; celtic; celts; dalraida; dna; epigraphyandlanguage; fartyshadesofgreen; genealogy; genetics; gingergene; godsgravesglyphs; helixmakemineadouble; hibernia; indoeuropeans; ireland; irish; neolithic; thebookofinvasions
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To: SatinDoll

Thanks SD!


61 posted on 01/11/2014 6:53:57 PM PST by SunkenCiv (http://www.freerepublic.com/~mestamachine/)
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To: NYer

Irish and German ancestors here. I’ll have to read this and find out how complex I am. LOL!


62 posted on 01/11/2014 7:29:34 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: NYer

The obvious similarities of culture, pale skin, tendency to red hair have historically been prescribed to the two people’s sharing a common celtic ancestry.

Vikings?


63 posted on 01/11/2014 7:42:13 PM PST by ZULU (Magua is sitting in the Oval Office. Ted Cruz/Phil Robertson in 2016.)
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To: Mears; All

The “black Irish” are more likely to be the result of the many Spanish sailers who were wrecked on the Irish shores when the Spanish Armada was destroyed. Catholic Ireland welcomed Catholic Spaniards. England was not so kind.

Regarding the red heads, what about the Neanderthal genes that have been suggested conferred that trait?


64 posted on 01/12/2014 12:51:45 AM PST by gleeaikin
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
CHRIST in BRITAIN http://www.greatdreams.com/jesus2.htm

Good article.

65 posted on 01/12/2014 3:29:02 AM PST by Partisan Gunslinger
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To: MD Expat in PA

Right...I read somewhere years ago that the redheaded irish were a direct result of the norse/viking settling Ireland.

As a related aside:
Years ago I had occasion to visit Algeria w/ WHO. Was taken around Algiers by a Berber-Kabyle fellow who had freckles. The Berber gentleman explained that they had people in their ethnic group who had red hair and freckles. Those who had these traits were very proud of them. He explained to me that it was the norse/viking influence from over 1000 years ago.


66 posted on 01/12/2014 6:34:55 AM PST by Dudoight
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To: Dudoight
Years ago I had occasion to visit Algeria w/ WHO. Was taken around Algiers by a Berber-Kabyle fellow who had freckles. The Berber gentleman explained that they had people in their ethnic group who had red hair and freckles. Those who had these traits were very proud of them. He explained to me that it was the norse/viking influence from over 1000 years ago.

Back in October, I traveled to England on business to visit our parent company located in the East Riding of Yorkshire, the city of Hull. Beautiful country BTW and the people were extremely nice and friendly even as, although we supposedly speak the same language, I had trouble understanding a lot of them. LOL!

I was amazed how so many of the people in this area of England were blue eyed and blonde. They looked rather more like Scandinavians than what I think of as being typically “English”. But I visited one of the local museums and learned that this area of England had been heavily settled by Vikings. My ancestors evidently “got around”.

67 posted on 01/12/2014 7:24:01 AM PST by MD Expat in PA
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To: NYer

Thanks for posting. I’d heard this before.

I am of Scottish descent and we (my family) have Rh (-) blood, a mutation and the origins of which can be traced to the Basque people who have 30% Rh (-) blood. It’s thought the original mutation started in Northern Spain and spread to the British Isles.


68 posted on 01/12/2014 5:55:42 PM PST by Bon of Babble (Don't want to brag...but I can still fit into the earrings I wore in high school!!)
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To: Scoutmaster

There you go bringing class into it again!


69 posted on 01/13/2014 8:19:11 AM PST by Notforprophet
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To: MD Expat in PA

As I recall, the viking/norse settled areas in Italy, Russia and Normandy was definitely ‘invaded’ and influenced genetically, those years ago.


70 posted on 01/14/2014 5:57:27 AM PST by Dudoight
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To: livius
Also, if you’re a woman, you can’t get a very clear reading on the genetic background since you’re missing part of it. If you have a brother, have him do it.

I think perhaps you are partly confused on this.

Females, as well as males, can discover their ancient maternal lineage through DNA testing. Because a father's mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) is destroyed at fertilization, a child inherits only the mother's mitochondrial DNA, thus preserving the maternal link to the ancient past. Due to this unique inheritance pattern, both males and females may directly contribute a DNA sample for testing the maternal lineage.

http://ldna.ancestry.com/learnMoreMaternal.aspx

A male providing his Y-chromosome sample also represents the DNA of his father, paternal grandfather, and so on up the paternal line. Y-chromosome results are generally identical throughout the paternal line. But because mutations do occur, it is possible for a son's results to be slightly different from his father's or his brother's.

Women, in spite of not carrying a Y-chromosome, can still trace their paternal lineage. Using a DNA sample provided by a brother, father, or another paternal relative (for example, a male cousin) a woman can treat these Y results as if they were her own.

http://ldna.ancestry.com/learnMorePaternal.aspx

So basically a woman can trace her material ancestry through her own DNA sample without having to also submit the DNA of a male sibling or paternal relative but if she wants to trace her paternal lineage she would have to use the DNA sample provided by a full brother, her father, or another paternal relative (for example, a male cousin).

So if I do decide to get a 23andMe test, I’d probably offer and pay for my brother to get one too in order to get a more complete picture.

71 posted on 01/15/2014 5:42:54 PM PST by MD Expat in PA
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72 posted on 10/16/2017 6:36:12 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (www.tapatalk.com/groups/godsgravesglyphs/, forum.darwincentral.org, www.gopbriefingroom.com)
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73 posted on 04/20/2021 4:22:59 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Imagine an imaginary menagerie manager imagining managing an imaginary menagerie.)
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