Posted on 02/25/2013 9:25:42 PM PST by Seizethecarp
Today, I had a conversation with an investigator from the Cold Case Posse in AZ. We talked and I expanded on several dossiers filled with evidence for over an hour. They asked for all of my relevant information on Obama, the Harry Bounel alias evidence, and the dossiers I completed on Stanley Ann Dunham, her parents, and Michelle Obama as well. They have it all. BTW they also say that it looks like my information cannot be disproved and will be useful.
I have proof, definitive proof that Stanley Ann Dunham was in WA state in "1961" as per the issuance of a SSN numident in her name with the SSN 535-40-8522. There is no way that she was in HI and I have proof because in the fall she was in college in WA, not HI.
(Excerpt) Read more at obamareleaseyourrecords.blogspot.com ...
And you, just like everyone else, have no idea who his mother and father was, where he was born, when he was born or where he was born. Face it. Your two thousand comments are just comments and tell us nothing. All I'm suggesting is that everyone should stop trying to force the square peg of Stanley Ann Dunham into the round hole of motherhood for which no proof has ever been shown to exist.
And don't talk to me about a calm, rational discussion, because every time I point out the obvious - that no one knows for certain WHO HE IS, the attack dogs come out snarling and barking and biting, because the truth scares them. The truth is you DO NOT KNOW. And not knowing is FRIGHTENING, so what some do is attack the messenger. How clever is that?
Furthermore, some of you have been puddling around in the same cesspool of vouyerism that places a young high school girl into bed with a black man 35 years older, older than even her own father, you’ve placed that girl in pornographic poses in your imagination when she was fifteen years old because it’s been clearly shown the photographs of the model date from 1958 and were printed in New York while she was still in school somewhere in Seattle. You can kick and scream all you want, call me names in black letters ten foot high, but one thing always leads to another, nothing happens in isolation. Throw a rock into the lake and there are ripples all over. Try explaining to me how Frank could have taken photographs of a fifteen year old who wasn’t in Hawaii, let alone made her pregnant without ending up in jail.
You’re pathetic.
There’s a marxist in the White House and you can’t think of anything better than to attack me?
Oh boy, I do love the one where Frank is so embarrassed he has to get the kenyan student to act as a surrogate. I’ve seen pretzels in better shape than some of the garbage I’ve read here.
Have fun, I’m bored now and have lost interest. Maybe it’s true; you get the government you deserve. Sadly, the whole world has to suffer along with you.
Thank you for the ping. For some reason, it prompted me to look for the first time at your profile page. After reading that very brief acct, mere verbal thanks hardly seem sufficient. I will say it anyway: thank you, thank you for your service.
I also want to add this: you are the classiest poster I have encountered anywhere online. I use the term ‘classy’ for want of a better one. What I mean is that you consistently embody honor and integrity in what you say and how you say it. When I spot your screenname, I know the post will be well worth reading...and it always is.
As for Obama, I have come to the firm conclusion that his autobiographical blurb, on file and updated for 13 yrs w his literary agency, is the key to the entire conundrum. He could not and did not lie about his country of origin in 1980. Back then the truth was still accessible, and the ever-ignorant Obama didn’t know enough to hide it. He told the agency he was born in Kenya because he was, and they could independently check that fact easily enough. It wasn’t until much later that the records were scrubbed or sealed to the full extent possible and the truth obscured. Fortunately copies of the Dystel & Goderich bio came to light, and the truth was preserved for all to see.
For anyone who missed it, here is the official Obama bio from 1991:
“Barack Obama, the first African-American president of the Harvard Law Review, was born in Kenya and raised in Indonesia and Hawaii. The son of an American anthropologist and a Kenyan finance minister, he attended Columbia University and worked as a financial journalist and editor for Business International Corporation. He served as project coordinator in Harlem for the New York Public Interest Research Group, and was Executive Director of the Developing Communities Project in Chicago’s South Side. His commitment to social and racial issues will be evident in his first book, Journeys in Black and White.”
And your comment, unfortunately, makes you appear to be fairly unhinged. Nice personal attack on me, btw.
There are plenty of people on FR who subscribe to the FMD theory. Here's an example from another thread, just today, by someone not even involved in this current discussion: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2993229/posts?page=13#13
You appear to utterly despise Joel Gilbert and his "mockumentary" Dreams From My Real Father, but you have never said (that I'm aware of) whether or not you've actually watched the entire 1 1/2 hour film. I have, and the case it makes is much, much more compelling IMHO than the "Mal/Val" theory you incessantly proffer.
It's true that we don't know exactly who the man calling himself "Obama" is, or even where or when he was born, at least from a documentation standpoint. Not all origins scenarios are created equal however, and the Mal/Val posit seems vanishingly unlikely compared to other, more oft-discussed ones. But then, that's probably just my normalcy bias talking.
"Back then the truth was still accessible, and the ever-ignorant Obama didn’t know enough to hide it. He told the agency he was born in Kenya because he was, and they could independently check that fact easily enough.
Indeed. And that could still be the case, even if "Obama" was a convenient name to append to the unexpected complication produced by an underage daughter knocked up by the grandfather's card-playing buddy and noted communist, FMD.
And I would like to point out to you that neither you nor anyone else has ever had the benefit of reading the results of the research our group of freepers carried out over a period of two years, because I have never been able to complete the story. I always get to the same point, the Seattle period, and before I can take the next step, and show just who was living at Capitol Hill and how the people are connected, out come the knives and ridicule, over and over again.
Someone has constructed a narrative which mixes up every character with others and gives them false identification, describes many in such a fashion as they become unrecognizable, and in cunning fashion, presents the scenario in such a twisted, distorted narrative that I would need to write a book to rebutt the numerous deliberate stupidities.
And we all know who that is.
Now do yourself a favour and ask yourself, why would anyone spend so much effort on misinformation to contort simple facts about names and dates and events?
I use the word pathetic. Because that’s exactly what it is.
Four years and more, and all you’ve got is Frank Marshall Davis.
You’re very welcome. A compliment from you is one to truly cherish. :)
As for Barry/Barack’s father, I absolutely don’t claim to know who he is/was. Perhaps SAD became pregnant from FMD and panicked. Looking around for a suitable male counterpart, she hit on Barrack Obama the Kenyan.
Or it could all have fallen out some other way. I must admit I see little or no family resemblance between Barry/Barack and the Obama clan. The Dunham resemblance, however, is so overwhelming it may obscure the paternal genes.
I haven’t seen the Gilbert film, but I learned some vital details about it from DL. From what I’ve gathered, there’s no question the woman in the explicit photos is SAD and the place where the photos were taken is FMD’s living room. (Even Jack Cashill believes these two points, and he is an exceedingly sharp investigator, not easily fooled). Does that make FMD Barry’s father? Not automatically—though it increases the odds.
Bottom line, I remain convinced Barry was born in Kenya. DL made a pretty strong case for Canada, though, and if in the end that turns out to be the place I wouldn’t be shocked. For now, my $ is on Kenya, and I do believe in time we’ll know the truth.
Per Fred Nerks:
“And don’t talk to me about a calm, rational discussion, because every time I point out the obvious - that no one knows for certain WHO HE IS, the attack dogs come out snarling and barking and biting, because the truth scares them.”
This is false. Fred Nerks does not come on eligibility threads, particularly ones that I start, to merely “point out the obvious - that no one know for certain WHO HE IS.”
Fred Nerks (FN) has an agenda to hijack the thread into a discussion of ludicrous claims which if accepted as true by unwary FReepers could lead them to be seduced by Fred Nerks into exploring his totally impossible, incoherent Mal-Val narrative.
In a transparent effort to coax unwary, credulous, gullible FReepers to accept the possibility that Barry’s dad is Malcolm X and that Valerie Sarruf is his mom:
FN bullies any FReeper that agrees that corroborated contemporaneous evidence and witnesses prove that Stanley Ann is unquestionably Barry’s mom.
FN bullies any FReeper that believes that BHO Sr. is Barry’s dad.
FN bullies any FReeper that suspects that FMD is Barry’s dad.
FN spams eligibility threads with nonsense claiming to disprove that Stanley Ann was ever in HI before 1964 or was ever with baby Barry before 1964, especially in WA. The year 1964 is when the Mal-Mal narrative postulates a baby-swap of baby Roman Obama for Malcolm S and Valerie Sarruf’s baby Barry. In the Mal-Val narrative, only baby Roman had the name BHO II at birth, not Barry.
After I listed clear logical and temporal defects in FN’s Mal-Val narrative claims in comments #461 and #466, FN didn’t attempt to defend the indefensible claims in those comments, but instead in comment #467 FN launched into specious speculation regarding an as-yet totally unsubstantiated intimate relationship (or any relationship) between Malcolm X and Valerie Sarruf...but he neglected to mention Valerie Sarruf’s name I comment #477.
“She” in FN’s comment #477 quoted below is meant to be Valerie Sarruf:
“She might have been the woman in the dark glasses at the MX funeral, she probably wrote the eulogy printed under the name Jo Ann Newman, she taught him the Shakespeare he quoted in his speech at the Oxford Union, she’s a relative of the baby-sitter by marriage...and as for the rest of the story, someone else will have to tell you. Might as well learn to love your President, because he’s planning to be a permanent fixture, and freepers like YOU are here to help make it happen.”
It is easy to see what drew FN to this thread. It was the title “Obama Mama In WA in 1961.” FN’s obsession with stamping out any association between SADO and Barry appears to compel FN to hijack every thread that affirms SADO as Barry’s mom and to spam it with his Mal-Val nonsense about the Asian Anna and her baby Roman based solely on Mary Toutonghi’s faulty 47-year-old memory. FN’s mastery of picture posting boosts FN’s credibility in the eyes of those not familiar with FN’s ulterior motive: Push the Mal-Val narrative!
LET ME MAKE ONE FINAL OBSERVATION, WHICH, IN THE LIGHT OF YOUR ACCUSATIONS, MIGHT SURPRISE YOU.
FRED NERKS DID NOT WRITE THE VAL-MAL NARRATIVE. IT WAS WRITTEN BY SOMEONE WHO PICKED UP BITS AND PIECES FROM THE COMMENTS ON FR MADE BY A NUMBER OF FREEPERS AT RANDOM OVER A PERIOD OF TIME WHICH WERE MOSTLY TOTALLY UNCONNECTED.
IT’S NOTHING BUT A MIRAGE POSTED AS A VANITY. HOW EASILY FOOLED YOU ARE.
Very, very apt usage of the term ‘bully’. That has been the MO on these threads from certain quarters for a long time now. Maybe people are finally getting sick and tired of getting bullied so much. We shall see.
You are an idiot and you are malicious. I’m surprised your head hasn’t exploded as the result of your rage. The moment it looks like your precious Frank Marshall Davis might not be the culprit, you totally lose focus and spit all over the page. The Val-Mal narrative is entirely your creation. You picked up bits of information from comments made on threads over a long period and spun unrelated people into a story that only the author of Alice Through the Looking Glass could do justice to. You’ve researched nothing. All you have ever done is copied from others and followed me like a foul smell, sending your attack dogs to bark at me through private mail instructions. If I did the same thing you did, and that is collect statements made by various freepers and various threads and strung them alltogether (including links posted to Youtube videos posted as a matter of interest,) I would expect to be exposed as a fraud. That’s why you spittle and rant, isn’t it, you know you are on shaky ground. Malicious. Take your medication. You have an obscure mental condition, learn to take care of it.
Typo, grammar -25 points
Given that nothing before 1972 is very clear it is difficult to rule in or rule out any scenario. And with these references to Kenya it can be said ‘someone knew something’ before it was covered up.
The problem with the physically born in Kenya scenario is that nothing fits that situation in the broader timeline. There was no actual ongoing relationship (if there ever was ANY relationship) between Obama and SAD. The logistics of travel to and from Kenya are incredible in 1961. There is no sign of Obama Sr. leaving the US after he arrived in 1959. It just does not work with other data points that are establlished.
That said, there could be a formal Kenya connection. Of course, Obama could claim Kenya citizenship through his namesake and legal (as of at least 1963) father. In fact, with this namesake father in Hawaii in December of 1971 Obama II could have obtained 100% Kenyan citizenship at that time. His namesake father played some legal role in the events of 1971. What that role is still unknown. But was there by design in conjunction with SAD’s visit from Indonesia.
Either formally or informally elements like the biography write up indicate that Obama had adopted the ‘I am a Kenyan’ narrative. It has a much more romantic ring to it than the bastard child of a foreigner or a commie. Of course its implications are less romantic when compared to Article II, Section 1. So they have been trying to down play the ‘I am a Kenyan’ narrative.
I do believe there was some ‘official’ connection to Kenya. After all, why else would Rahm take his family over to Kenya for vacation in December of 2008. No one really believes that ‘safari’ story do they? He may have been hunting - but it was for documents, not big game!
“The moment it looks like your precious Frank Marshall Davis might not be the culprit, you totally lose focus and spit all over the page. The Val-Mal narrative is entirely your creation.”
I have upbraided FN for FN’s racist, ageist slanders against FMD’s appearance in his early 50s, but FN seems to have forgotten my repeated statements whenever FN has posted dishonestly labeled pictures of baby Barry and baby David and told lies to FReepers that they are the same baby (a key element of FN’s Mal-Val narrative that FN attributes to me now).
Whenever FN has posted those baby pictures of David and Barry I have reminded FN that the fact that two claimed brothers look so much alike is an extremely strong validation point for the premise that they have the same biological father, BHO Sr.
While FMD is a possibility, I have always said that I am inclined to regard BHO Sr. as Barry’s actual dad and his likeness to David only reinforces that.
BTW, FN’s photo skills were put to good use in comparing the nude woman to the SADO pics. Having seen FN’s blow-ups of the noses and teeth and the full-on face comparison up-thread, the naked woman does not appear to me to be SADO.
As FN points out, SADO’s nose is asymmetric and the nude model’s nose if very symmetric. Even though the nude’s chin is hidden in one picture, it is not in the full-on comparison and SADO’s “Dunham” chin is much deeper.
So this, in my mind, removes the nudie pics as possible proof that FMD and SADO were in a room together with her nude. It does not eliminate FMD as the dad, it just doesn’t support him and lots of INS FOIA docs support BHO Sr. as Barry’s dad.
As to FN’s latest desperate falsehood that it is Seizethecarp who dreamed up and is promoting the Mal-Val narrative, the evidence that FN is the one promoting Mal-Val is all over this thread, if you know what to look for.
I just took the time to identify all of the elements of the Mal-Val narrative by looking at FN’s repetitive spam posts and I gave the narrative a name!
I started the Mal-Val thread to alert FReepers to Fred Nerks’ sneaky tactics of coming onto eligibility theads at the end and hijacking them with seemingly unrelated fragmentary evidence using fancy photos and tantalizing insinuations as a lure to newbie FReepers.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/2913366/posts
On eligibility threads FN will introduce to following Mal-Val narrative themes over and over:
SADO is not Barry’s mom and never saw him before 1964
SADO was never in WA in 1961-62 and never in HI before 1964
SADO did not graduate from Mercer in 1960
Baby David never existed and his pictures with Mark are “actually” baby Barry
Very young Mark, the dark boy, is Roman Obama
Roman Obama was born the first BHO II and was taken to WA by his mom, Asian Anna, but subsequently swapped with Baby Barry with Barry assuming the BHO ID in HI and Roman going back to Kenya with BHO Sr. and Ruth and becoming Roman and going to college in Russia later.
The baby that Toutonghi sat for in WA is Roman the son of Asian Anna a hidden prior wife of BHO Sr.
Two pictures of BHO Sr. in proximity to two Asian women, one ID’d as Anne at a party (with a Japanese last name in fact) and the other at BHO Sr’s dock departure picture (who appears to be a different woman to me) supposedly provide tantalizing clues as to the identity of the unknown Anna in Seattle who was not SADO.
Finally, pictures of Malcolm X and Valerie Sarruf are introduced onto the tread and they are morphed and compared to pictures of Barry.
It was Fred Nerks that accidentally revealed the name of the woman that FN and FN’s fellow “researchers” had kept hidden, Valerie Sarruf, but FN tried to blame another FReeper for letting the name out. But FN did it and I proved it in the Mal Val thread:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/2913366/posts
It is FN who insists, consistent with the Mal-Val conspiracy theory, that ALL of the following documents must be forged (because they stand in the way of Malcolm X and Valerie Sarruf being Barry’s parents, it seems):
Forged: Multiple U of WA transcripts for SADO, some of which include 1960 U of HI credits and Mercer HS graduation
Forged: Multiple U of HI transcripts for SADO that include U of WA credits
Forged: All INS FOIA documents affirming BHO Sr. and SADO relationship, pregnancy, marriage and her intent to go to WA in 1961.
Of course, I regard all of these documents to be genuine and to cross-corroborate each other. It is only proponents of the Mal-Val narrative who stalk and spam eligibility threads with these same claims over and over again. They appear to be trolling for unwary new FReepers to lure into their Mal-Val conspiracy web using lots of artful pictures some creative and some totally dishonest.
I used the pictures YOU posted and overlaid the two images without any retouching or manipulation. Anyone can make this same comparison for themselves. The faces lined up perfectly. It IS the same woman. Again, why are you fighting this?? It doesn't prove anything about Frank Marshall Davis.
A waste of time to continue the discussion?? Then why did you not stop here??
You aren’t rational, you don’t play by any kind of rational rules, and it is obvious you have no interest in finding any kind of truth; your purpose is merely to attack those who are.
I mean, at this point you’re the ethereal version of someone with spittle and froth flying while you jump up and down and scream, and fling handfuls of poo.
Cool story, but ultimately, nothing but pointless, overwrought and dishonest whining.
This is the second time you have called me a troll on this thread that I started. You have done the same thing on other threads that I started.
So who is the troll, Brown Deer?
Wouldn’t that be someone who goes onto a thread that someone else started and insults them for merely defending the clear premise of the thread?
Fred Nerks’ comment #147 about BHO Sr. and Tom Mboya is actually part of a tangential Mal-Val narrative sub-plot, but a main thrust for FN has been to discredit any evidence that would place BHO Sr. together with SADO in Russian class at UH in the fall of 1960. This effort by FN is apparently designed to help persuade FReepers that Malcolm X could be Barry’s dad by knocking back BHO Sr. as a candidate.
So although comment #147 is not the first explicit Mal-Val comment by FN it is tangentially Mal-Val, IMO.
FN posted numerous blatant Mal-Val comments later including the infamous “two boys” pics and the two Asian women near BHO Sr.
This is Mal-Val trolling by FN and you, Brown Deer, are obviously trolling in support of FN, as usual.
I can’t help but noticing that neither Fred Nerks nor Brown Deer dispute a single element of the Mal-Val narrative that I have attributed to them. I have read FN’s comments very carefully over the past two years and I am probably the foremost expert on the Mal-Val narrative who is not a believer/troller!
SADO is not Barry’s mom and never saw him before 1964
Not quite, she apparently showed up in Hawaii to file for divorce from a man there's no real evidence she married, in January 1964, and was granted custody of an unidentified child in March 1964. That's about the time we see her with little zero at the zoo. She had that little boy with her when she showed him to Susan Blake and according to Susan, that was when he was just a few weeks old after Susan came home from somewhere when there were forest fires. Conjecture has placed that sometime in August 1961. It's hard to backtrack that now, because the video that showed Susan in all her glory has been cut back to a few seconds. Just where zero was between birth and showing up at the zoo in Hawaii is a little difficult to ascertain.
SADO was never in WA in 1961-62 and never in HI before 1964
Not true. You haven't been paying attention, although you have been following me around like I had something you dearly wanted or you think I stole it from you...to the extent that you have the comment numbers of almost everything I wrote. Weird. Stanley Ann Dunham did visit Susan Blake and she did have a baby with her, she did tell Susan she had married a black man, and then Susan never saw her again. Susan said she went 'East' - although you're supposed to believe she went to the U of WA. Which Maxine Box, her very very best friend, also attended. But Maxine never saw her there either.
SADO did not graduate from Mercer in 1960
That's based on the reluctance of several of her 'classmates' who maintained they have year-books, to show said yearbooks. Said yearbooks have been lost, have been stolen...and the one and only image of her in sweater and pearls which is supposed to be a graduation image, is cropped from a page with the other faces of the students chopped in such a way they are not recognizable.
Baby David never existed and his pictures with Mark are “actually” baby Barry
There's a photograph of two little boys and one of them is zero. I don't give a hoot what Mark Ndesandjo named the children on his webpage. After I called the images into question, he changed the photographs and then removed them altogether.
Very young Mark, the dark boy, is Roman Obama
The two little boys, one a little older than the other, are too close in age to be brothers. One looks like the kenyan student the other looks like zero who doesn't. How the child of the kenyan came to be sitting next to zero is something you should really be curious about. I know I am. Just where was that photograph taken?
Roman Obama was born the first BHO II and was taken to WA by his mom, Asian Anna, but subsequently swapped with Baby Barry with Barry assuming the BHO ID in HI and Roman going back to Kenya with BHO Sr. and Ruth and becoming Roman and going to college in Russia later.
This is where you go right off the rails into some sort of time warp. Up until this, you had it going fairly good. You could evidently see that there were two little boys and one was just the right age to have been baby-sat by Mary in JANUARY 1961. It's my interpretation that the dark boy is the child of the kenyan student and his US citizen wife from whom he said he was seperated...whose parents objected to the marriage. The child whom they were considering putting up for adoption.
The baby that Toutonghi sat for in WA is Roman the son of Asian Anna a hidden prior wife of BHO Sr.
Why do you insist on describing ANNA OBAMA as Asian? No one knows for certain who she is/was or what she looked like. There were apparently TWO females the kenyan student was involved with in Hawaii, one might have been an Ann, the other an Anna. Neil Abercrombie remembers Ann. Neil didn't say Ann was Asian. The girl sitting next to the kenyan student at the Nachmannofs was identified as ANNE/USA and if you know she was Japanese and know her name as you say, why not let us all know?
And now I've really had enough for one day, but I know you'll want to see the two little boys again, so here they are:
The two sets of images that were on the original Mark Ndesandjo website. The tinted version came first, the black and white followed, and was removed within days.
And the above images show little zero playing in someone's backyard...looks tropical?
And I think these four little zero's can speak for themselves.
It bothers you for people to become more self-sufficient? Women learning to grow and can food, really? Now that is scary stuff...
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